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Scotland

By Otto Flick30/6 10:37Tue Jun 30 10:37:36 2020

Views: 903

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/jun/29/sturgeon-refuses-to-rule-out-scotland-screening-visitors-from-england

Should it does ome to pass, and she is not playing her usual games, and is justified...that would have to be a shocking inditement of the UK government's strategy.

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Re: Scotland

By cufc infinity (cufc_infinity)1/7 13:05Wed Jul 1 13:05:09 2020In response to ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 292

Cross border cluster identified between annan and Carlisle.

Shows how pointless border willy waving by wee Nicky is - people from annan gretna shop / work in Carlisle, people from Carlisle will nip to gretna gateway for shopping now the shops are reopening (and be back home the same afternoon so nixing any quarantine bollox)

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Re: Scotland

By Mr S (Mr Staffordshire)2/7 08:02Thu Jul 2 08:02:56 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 147

Nice place, Gretna Gateway.

I was there back in October, looked it was opened fairly recently.

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Re: Scotland

By Dougie MacDougall2/7 09:56Thu Jul 2 09:56:08 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 82

Been open for at least 20 years I'd say - been extended a bit in recent years. A regular stop-off point for me going back up the road. Depending on traffic, I can just about stretch to there as a first stop.

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Re: Scotland

By Baldman2/7 08:11Thu Jul 2 08:11:26 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 135

Haven't they rebranded it as a Somerfield yet?

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Re: Scotland

By Mr S (Mr Staffordshire)2/7 08:12Thu Jul 2 08:12:39 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 133

I dunno.

Ask him.

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Re: Scotland

By NWS2/7 07:32Thu Jul 2 07:32:33 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 159

I'm sure I saw Carlisle play a friendly at Annan Athletic when I lived up there

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Re: Scotland

By Dougie MacDougall1/7 13:17Wed Jul 1 13:17:40 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 268

CLOSE THE BORDER.

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Re: Scotland

By cufc infinity (cufc_infinity)1/7 13:40Wed Jul 1 13:40:54 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 256

Situation needlessly complicated by having to liaise Anglo and Scottish versions of health bodies etc - time to merge them all and finally consign the centuries dead concepts of Scotland and England to the bin :-)

Edited by cufc_infinity at 13:41:29 on 1st July 2020

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Re: Scotland

By Dougie MacDougall1/7 13:54Wed Jul 1 13:54:05 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 243

Good luck with that one. You must be getting pretty nervous.

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Re: Scotland

By cufc infinity (cufc_infinity)1/7 14:57Wed Jul 1 14:57:55 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 230

We will allow you to keep national sports teams - mostly for amusement :-)

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Re: Scotland

By Dougie MacDougall1/7 15:19Wed Jul 1 15:19:46 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 219

tick tock

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Re: Scotland

By cufc infinity (cufc_infinity)1/7 15:32Wed Jul 1 15:32:21 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 221

yes, independence is running out of time alright

If wee nicky, after 10 years of tory rule, brexit nightmare, and boris' covid cockups is still too jittery to call a referendum she never will. Maybe the rumours I'm hearing the knives are out for her are right? Still got the salmond of knowledge to get his revenge too...

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Re: Scotland

By Dougie MacDougall1/7 15:50Wed Jul 1 15:50:09 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 214

Keep clutching at those straws. I hope you didn't choke on the popcorn you had saved up for the Salmond trial.

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Re: Scotland

By cufc infinity (cufc_infinity)1/7 19:56Wed Jul 1 19:56:03 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 188

That was a free spin for unionists. Salmond found guilty or not, being accused by those in his own party was going to kick off a civil war

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Re: Scotland

By ILC30/6 14:59Tue Jun 30 14:59:02 2020In response to ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 474

She has been absolutely brilliant during the crisis. If only she had been in charge of Boris.....

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Re: Scotland

By Money Shot30/6 15:27Tue Jun 30 15:27:12 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 458

She has been impressive in her briefings, fully explaining why every decision is being made.

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Re: Scotland

By carrotcruncher(hfc)30/6 14:35Tue Jun 30 14:35:13 2020In response to ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 490

Talking about going to our family in Scotland in a month or so.

If we promise to drive from Wales to Scotland but not stop in England will that be ok? It's a long trek between Monmouth and Gretna without a pee stop, especially at my age!

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Greece

By Mr S (Mr Staffordshire)30/6 11:23Tue Jun 30 11:23:29 2020In response to ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 731

Greece extends travel ban for UK visitors to 15th July.

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Re: Greece

By Greek Card30/6 13:50Tue Jun 30 13:50:03 2020In response to GreeceTop of thread

Views: 533

Good - you filthy bastards.

In other news I'll be here on Monday;

/www.google.com/search?q=samothraki&client=firefox-b-d&sxsrf=ALeKk0245kxraM7VrwXDSh87L7PGtqMIMw:1593521312959&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwj96LO-yanqAhULkxQKHZRvCl8Q_AUoAXoECBwQAw&biw=1366&bih=654

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Re: Greece

By Lord M Ox (Marked Ox)30/6 15:23Tue Jun 30 15:23:54 2020In response to Re: GreeceTop of thread

Views: 433

What a dump, nothing on Port Talbot.

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Re: Scotland

By Dougie MacDougall30/6 10:53Tue Jun 30 10:53:16 2020In response to ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 764

The strategy in Scotland is to eradicate - as much as is possible - the virus and to try and keep it under control as much as possible. That way they see an overall quicker "return to normal" with a lot less deaths.

At yesterday's briefing she was asked what was the difference between her approach and the PM's approach and said that she didn't know what it was as he hadn't articulated it to her - or any of the other devolved administrations - but it seemed to be that he wanted to suppress it to the point where the health service didn't get overwhelmed, which seems dangerous and risky to me.

No COBRA meetings for weeks. No consultation with, nor prior warning to, the devolved governments about the quarantine proposals, despite it directly impacting them. Four nations meetings continue with ministers but they are along the lines of "this is what we've done" rather than discussing and agreeing a common way forwards.

Sounds like the whole thing has broken down.

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Re: Scotland

By Diane Abbott's Afro (The Luton Fan)30/6 11:32Tue Jun 30 11:32:57 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 703

It broke down the minute the Dominic Cummings affair was brought to light. That was a watershed in the whole crisis.

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Re: Scotland

By Pol Pot30/6 11:44Tue Jun 30 11:44:01 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 691

Does that mean journalists put public health at risk by covering the story? Should they have covered it up?

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Re: Scotland

By Diane Abbott's Afro (The Luton Fan)30/6 14:57Tue Jun 30 14:57:37 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 449

Journalists are key workers and exempt from any requirements.

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Re: Scotland

By Pol Pot30/6 15:48Tue Jun 30 15:48:22 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 445

I'm not talking about restrictions being imposed on journalists, I'm asking - given some people think the Cummings story has resulted in people breaking lockdown and, in theory, leading to illness and deaths - if the responsible thing would have been for them to ignore or downplay the story?

After all, this has happened with other contentious issues (and I won't make Lord Marked Ox cry again by mentioning a very obvious one).

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Re: Scotland

By Lord M Ox (Marked Ox)1/7 08:26Wed Jul 1 08:26:31 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 294

?

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Re: Scotland

By Howard RMI30/6 11:39Tue Jun 30 11:39:14 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 681

What about when the Scottish Chief Medical Officer broke the lockdown rules plus the Labour MPs ?

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Re: Scotland

By gertcha30/6 14:54Tue Jun 30 14:54:26 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 443

Classic whatiffery

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Re: Scotland

By Dougie MacDougall30/6 11:41Tue Jun 30 11:41:22 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 656

And was sacked the next day?

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Re: Scotland

By Dougie MacDougall30/6 11:37Tue Jun 30 11:37:42 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 665

In terms of co-operation between the four nations, you could possibly right.

It does appear though that it is the UKG who are out of step with the three devolved administrations though.

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Re: Scotland

By Diane Abbott's Afro (The Luton Fan)30/6 14:58Tue Jun 30 14:58:17 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 437

When it is run by Bozo the Clown, what do you expect?

See also Donald J Trump.

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Re: Scotland

By Dougie MacDougall30/6 15:02Tue Jun 30 15:02:20 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 434

Well quite clearly it is but I was doing my best to be diplomatic.

This government - or to be exact - the 10 Downing Street and inner circle do seem to have a serious bunker mentality.

I didn't see it myself but I saw someone comment - and I think there's merit in it - that Johnson's speech this morning was more of a campaign speech than anything, which for someone six months after an election with a majority of 80 is a very odd look. Almost as if, who exactly is he trying to sell this to.

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Re: Scotland

By Rob230/6 11:17Tue Jun 30 11:17:16 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 698

The whole devolved administration thing doesn't work here as the furlough, business grants etc are being paid by the UK treasury not local. If course it's much easier for Scotland and even worse Wales to have these contrasts if they don't care about the cost

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Re: Scotland

By KD198130/6 14:49Tue Jun 30 14:49:26 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 455

Seeing as we're one lump of land with no enforceable borders, it really is madness that there's three governments involved in this. There should have been one set of rules, the idea you drive from Chester to Truro but they can't drive six miles over the Welsh border is bat-shit crazy.
And, yes, it's also madness to have people making decisions if they're not responsible for the costs.

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Re: Scotland

By Dougie MacDougall30/6 11:31Tue Jun 30 11:31:28 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 676

Technically you're correct, however don't make the mistake of assuming that Scotland and Wales aren't impacted by the cost of this. So when the annual rumpus goes on about "Scotland's deficit" in large part that's down to allocation of UK debt and UK public spending.

First of all, the UKG is funding furlough and other schemes primarily through borrowing. That borrowing increases UKG debt which everyone will have to pay back over time, either through higher taxes, lower public spending or a combination of both. In the circumstances of a national crisis, its entirely the right thing to do, deal with the here and now and worry about it later.

This isn't some pot of money that the UKG out of its kindness "gifts" to Scotland and Wales, it's the UK's money that they are distributing to the people of the UK.

The devolved governments have very limited borrowing powers, the SG are lobbying very heavily right now to have those powers extended so that they can do more - and ultimately pay for it.

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Re: Scotland

By Baldman30/6 11:48Tue Jun 30 11:48:13 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 638

But Scotland does have a deficit, right? A budget deficit I mean?

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Re: Scotland

By Dougie MacDougall30/6 11:50Tue Jun 30 11:50:29 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 628

BoP or Fiscal?

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Re: Scotland

By Baldman30/6 11:57Tue Jun 30 11:57:03 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 621

Fiscal

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Re: Scotland

By Dougie MacDougall30/6 12:08Tue Jun 30 12:08:23 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 611

If you want to be 100% technically correct, Scotland doesn't have a deficit, the UK has the deficit, in the same way as England doesn't have a deficit. However, what there is, is a notional deficit which attempts to model Scotland's fiscal position as if it were a separate entity. At points in the past, Scotland has shown a notional surplus, currently it is showing a notional deficit.

What subject to debate - and we've been over this ground ad-infinitum is the following:

How accurate a lot of allocation of revenue - in particular - is in reality.
How fair is a lot of the allocation of UK level spending - pretty easy to work out the level of public spending actually in Scotland.
Finally and most crucially, this modelling is done in the context of Scotland being part of the UK, so what - if anything - does it tell us about the fiscal position of Scotland as an independent nation state.

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Re: Scotland

By Baldman30/6 12:17Tue Jun 30 12:17:24 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 600

Scotland's fiscal position would massively worsen in the event of independence without an answer to the currency question but, as you say, we've done that to death.

The payments for furlough and other support schemes will not impact Sturgeon's budget as I understand it. So the Scottish government does not need to balance the need for lockdown versus the pressure on the exchequer? That is an issue for Boris, but not for Sturge

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Re: Scotland

By Dougie MacDougall30/6 12:27Tue Jun 30 12:27:56 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 587

Furlough payments don't come out of the SG budget but it's a mistake - not saying you're doing it but plenty do - to think that ultimately "Scotland" won't pay for it - along with the rest of the UK.

I think the concern right now is that the SG thinks that the UKG is going to pull the plug on furlough and other schemes too soon and that will force them into moving less cautiously on the public health side of things. That's why they are looking for the Treasury to loosen the strings so that the SG can make up and possible shortfall with their own borrowing.

So you're wrong to suggest that the SG doesn't have to balance off the two competing pressures, it does, it just has very limited powers on the finances side to actually do what it thinks is the right thing.

I think - more than anything - COVID has shone a massive light onto the limitations of the devolved system.

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Re: Scotland

By Baldman30/6 12:45Tue Jun 30 12:45:50 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 571

The Scottish people will have to pay for it. But it will come from UK taxes. Therefore it's a free hit for Sturgeon. A cynic might suggest that the higher UK taxes have to be to pay for it, the better it will suit independence arguments.

As I have said before, the independence problem is exactly like the Brexit problem. It was always easy for the UK Govt to claim that anything that went wrong was due to Brussels. Sturge has the same free pass with blaming Westminster.

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Re: Scotland

By Dougie MacDougall30/6 12:54Tue Jun 30 12:54:35 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 560

Thing is though, with COVID, she goes out of her way to avoid blaming Westminster and won't even criticise actions the UKG take with respect to England - even though she obviously disagrees - despite journalists queuing up on a daily basis to try and tempt her into doing so - and I'm just watching them doing that right now.

You have to listen to what she actually says though, not how that is spun and reported, largely by the London based commentariat.

It's actually the public that's coming to that opinion themselves.

Although that said, she is absolutely tearing the arse out of Boris Johnson's big spending plans.

Edited by Dougie MacDougall at 12:56:26 on 30th June 2020

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Re: Scotland

By Baldman30/6 13:17Tue Jun 30 13:17:01 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 522

Which job do you think is easier... Scottish or Welsh leader vs UK leader?

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Re: Scotland

By Dougie MacDougall30/6 13:29Tue Jun 30 13:29:08 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 511

UK Leader undoubtedly, it's a much bigger job. I also know who would be better as the UK leader.

Not sure why that's relevant though, you might have a point if NS were a "Devolutionist", she's clearly not and would much prefer to be the leader of an independent country with all that means.

Then you get into ridiculous arguments about is it a bigger job to be US President or UK PM.

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Re: Scotland

By Baldman30/6 13:55Tue Jun 30 13:55:09 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 485

US president undoubtedly. Although he does enjoy a unique currency privilege.

The reason it is relevant is absolutely because Sturge is a Scexit politician.

Imagine if Farage had been UK PM (shudder). He would have frustrated Brussels at every turn and blamed them for every setback and engineered each situation to highlight the negative impact of surrendering sovereignty to a Parliament outside the country. His supporters might even say that he was being conciliatory or statesmanlike but by his very politics we would know that underneath everything he does is in pursuance of his ultimate goal.

Stop me if this starts to sound familiar.....

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Re: Scotland

By Dougie MacDougall30/6 14:06Tue Jun 30 14:06:57 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 476

I can't believe that I'm going to compare the two of them but Sturgeon and Farage both want the same basic thing, which is to get their country out of a political union which they think is not in its best interests. Of course, there's a completely different argument there about the motivations behind that and whether or not leaving those institutions would be good or bad.

You're right - given the hypothetical picture you are painting about Farage being PM - and lets give him the benefit of the doubt that he really is a true believer - at least he would be speaking from the perspective of not wanting to be part of what he was railing against.

That is a much more honest position than pretty much every PM to date, who has been keen to blame the EU for anything that's bad, claimed the credit for anything good that the EU did while all the while wanting to stay part of the EU.

The implication in your previous posts is that Sturgeon is behaving like that, that she's quite happy to blame Westminster when ever anything goes wrong, take credit for all the good stuff - and there's an element of that - but that she's fundamentally happy with the status quo and doesn't want to take on all the "difficult stuff" which is far from the truth.

If it were a Labour FM, railing at Westminster Tories to remain in power in Holyrood then you might have a point but I don't think its a massive secret that SNP want independence.

Edited by Dougie MacDougall at 14:07:28 on 30th June 2020

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Re: Scotland

By Baldman30/6 14:19Tue Jun 30 14:19:11 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 462

lets give him the benefit of the doubt that he really is a true believer

Ha ha, quite. I did stop and think about what he'd actually be like if he became PM.

That is a much more honest position than pretty much every PM to date, who has been keen to blame the EU for anything that's bad, claimed the credit for anything good that the EU did while all the while wanting to stay part of the EU.

Agreed. Completely reckless.

that she's fundamentally happy with the status quo and doesn't want to take on all the "difficult stuff" which is far from the truth

Oh no, I don't mean that. I believe she is sincere in her ambition, and in her belief that it would be the best for Scotland. I just mean to say that, when I see her act (and I only really see news reports of her when it is related to Westminster, as I don't really follow Scottish politics), I always think about it in the context of her ultimate goal.

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Re: Scotland

By Dougie MacDougall30/6 14:34Tue Jun 30 14:34:23 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 453

The SNP want independence, any SNP leader will always put forwards an agenda which seeks to achieve that.

However it would be a mistake to think that everything that she does or - indeed Salmond did - is all calculated with that in mind.

NS has always - and again as Salmond did before - been very keen to stress that she is FM of the whole country - including those who don't agree with her.

What is fundamental is that what she wants is what is best for Scotland, sometimes that will be in the context of working with the UK government on things which are mutually beneficial, sometimes it will be fighting them. The difference though is that what's good for the UK probably doesn't come into the equation - either way up.

There's also a recognition that while Scotland remains part of the UK, you have to work within that context.

I think the best example I can give you that disproves your argument is Brexit. If they were interested in burning down the house, they'd have let Brexit go through to demonstrate the folly of the Union. I don't think there was a party which was more united or fought harder to try and stop it.

You might say that was easy as it was a majority position in Scotland but she's taken a lot of criticism from certain sections of the party and wider movement for not letting the UK just get on with it. Also, a lot of the people she was standing up for - Remain voters - don't support her on the constitution. I say don't, in increasing numbers though it's more didn't then do now.

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Re: Scotland

By Baldman30/6 14:43Tue Jun 30 14:43:03 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 450

However it would be a mistake to think that everything that she does or - indeed Salmond did - is all calculated with that in mind.

Neither of us know what they have in mind of course. And those who want to remain part of the union see her very differently to you I belileve.

You might say that was easy as it was a majority position in Scotland

Well, as I say, neither of us know. Nor i suspect will our opinions agree.

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Re: Scotland

By Dougie MacDougall30/6 14:43Tue Jun 30 14:43:58 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 445

62/38 is a pretty good majority.

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Re: Scotland

By Baldman30/6 14:49Tue Jun 30 14:49:53 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 442

Yes, and my argument would be that is the motivation behind the SNP's stance.

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Re: Scotland

By Nigel L30/6 13:57Tue Jun 30 13:57:03 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 490

Equating Farage's brand of nationalism with Sturgeon's is preposterous.

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Re: Scotland

By Baldman30/6 13:58Tue Jun 30 13:58:06 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 490

Why is that?

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Re: Scotland

By Dougie MacDougall30/6 14:09Tue Jun 30 14:09:10 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 469

You're starting to let yourself down now - I thought you were a bit more savvy than this.

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Re: Scotland

By Baldman30/6 14:19Tue Jun 30 14:19:29 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 464

?

Edit to add: Save me the 'you're better than this, letting yourself down' etc. This is the internet, I'm not trying to impress you.

Edited by Baldman at 14:20:33 on 30th June 2020

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Re: Scotland

By Dougie MacDougall30/6 14:34Tue Jun 30 14:34:52 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 456

Yep - and I know trolling when I see it.

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Re: Scotland

By Baldman30/6 14:49Tue Jun 30 14:49:02 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 444

OK, I will spend time on this, although I shouldn't

I made a comparison between Farage as PM and Sturgeon as FM, which you took as the hypothetical it was and I enjoyed your answer. Nigel saw it very differently, and all I did was ask him to expand his point and expressed no opinion of my own, There are great differences between Sturge and Farage, but I'm not sure I can see why they would be relevant to the discussion. Hence the question.

Either the first hypothetical was trolling, and as you took it in the spirit it was intended I assume that it's not, or you seem to think asking for more info was trolling?

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Re: Scotland

By Nigel L30/6 16:05Tue Jun 30 16:05:21 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 389

Farage is a go it alone nationalist who yearns for the days when Brits could give out the orders and the Empire obeyed. His rhetoric is laden with British (actually English) exceptionalism and a worldview that sees the UK proudly rowing its own boat while being very suspicious of funny foreigners "who are not like us". He also doesn't like the idea of these strange people coming to the UK and gets furious if they have the gall to conduct conversations in their own language when he's commuting on the train in from Kent.

He is the parody ignorant Brit who, when on holiday "abroad", believes the stupid locals will only understand if he shouts loudly enough at them in English.

Sturgeon wants to "free" Scotland from what she perceives as an unequal partnership with England that stunts Scotland's potential. Her worldview is for Scotland to make its way as an independent nation by following a path similar to Ireland; exercising influence through membership of and cooperation with organisations of other nation states that share similar values while developing domestic policy agendas tailored to Scotland's needs.

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Re: Scotland

By Meerkat30/6 16:50Tue Jun 30 16:50:16 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 364

Is that a parody or trolling?
Farage is so anti foreigner he had two foreign wives....

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Re: Scotland

By Dougie MacDougall30/6 15:04Tue Jun 30 15:04:37 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 422

No problem, just getting a bit touchy I guess, however, that was sparked by an earlier comment, not from you though, about all nationalists being the same. Sort of lazy shite and muddled headed thinking that I don't associate with you.

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Re: Scotland

By UkrainianPhil (UkrainianPhil (YCFC))30/6 10:41Tue Jun 30 10:41:20 2020In response to ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 782

An excellent way to undermine freedom of movement, the destruction of which is the goal of every nationalist.

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Re: Scotland

By Dougie MacDougall30/6 10:46Tue Jun 30 10:46:14 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 761

So with specific reference to Scotland, can you back up that sweeping statement with actual facts?

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Re: Scotland

By UkrainianPhil (UkrainianPhil (YCFC))30/6 10:51Tue Jun 30 10:51:17 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 744

Screening English visitors and restricting their movements is implying that Scotland is a different country when it isn't. There is no active border.

Just as they don't stop trains at Northallerton and check Jocks and Geordies for COVID when you enter Yorkshire.

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Re: Scotland

By Dougie MacDougall30/6 10:57Tue Jun 30 10:57:32 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 721

Scotland is a different country always has been, at least since countries became a thing. Yorkshire is a county, always has been, at least since counties became a thing. Big, big difference.

The UK on the other hand is not and never has been a country. Similarly Great Britain is and has always been an island with a collection of smaller islands immediately off the coast.

So back to my original question - with specific reference to Scotland, some facts to back up your sweeping statement about all nationalists wanting to deny freedom of movement.

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Re: Scotland

By UkrainianPhil (UkrainianPhil (YCFC))30/6 11:16Tue Jun 30 11:16:28 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 682

Nationalists want to restrict the flow of "foreigners" coming into their country, restricting freedom of movement is a key way of doing that.

Have you been asleep during Brexit and not heard right-wing nutters like Farage, Johnson, Gove etc?

Scotland is not a country, and this is according to the United Nations which I will take as a decent authority in deciding i.e. the world organisation of countries rather than some joker off a football forum.

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Re: Scotland

By Dougie MacDougall30/6 11:36Tue Jun 30 11:36:18 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 665

The United Nations is an organisation whose members consist of Nation States not countries, so you are the one which is wrong.

I suggest you look at the difference between Nation States and countries if you don't believe me.

Anyway, you still haven't answered my question *with specific reference to Scotland* what evidence do you have that nationalists want to restrict freedom of movement. If anything the opposite is true.

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Re: Scotland

By cufc infinity (cufc_infinity)30/6 13:29Tue Jun 30 13:29:02 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 524

Country definition is vague, it's a cultural artefact rather than anything legal. Own king? Own army? Own currency? Own language? Anyways using any definition as a justification for stopping civilians entering rather than invading armies is a modern spin on defining borders, rather than anything relevant to what Scotland once was

So we're going down to Cumbria next week and if wee nicky krankie tries to stop us on the way back we'll punch her full in the face. Plus I know the back route via penton bridge.

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Re: Scotland

By The Very Revd. Roy Summersby KC30/6 13:48Tue Jun 30 13:48:43 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 492

I think a few sporrens might get readjusted if they want to try and keep proud covid riddled English out of our Kingdom

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Re: Scotland

By Dougie MacDougall30/6 13:33Tue Jun 30 13:33:11 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 506

Well in this context its the jurisdiction which she has legal responsibility for and that's what is important.

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Re: Scotland

By UkrainianPhil (UkrainianPhil (YCFC))30/6 12:04Tue Jun 30 12:04:14 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 613

The evidence presented at the start of the thread, that the Scots want to test English visitors.

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Re: Scotland

By Dougie MacDougall30/6 12:09Tue Jun 30 12:09:31 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 599

To be clear - those people calling for restrictions on travel are public health people, not the government.

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Re: Scotland

By DaveATFC30/6 10:49Tue Jun 30 10:49:29 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 748

So with specific reference to Scotland, can you back up that sweeping statement with actual facts?

That's not how this place works mate!

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Re: Scotland

By Dougie MacDougall30/6 10:57Tue Jun 30 10:57:56 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 717

Oh, I'm not holding my breath.

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Re: Scotland

By interserie30/6 11:02Tue Jun 30 11:02:01 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 711

Say goodbye to those Barnett Formula payments on Day One.

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Re: Scotland

By Dougie MacDougall30/6 11:06Tue Jun 30 11:06:52 2020In response to Re: ScotlandTop of thread

Views: 698

Always amazes me that people don't understand how the Barnett formula actually works.

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